Milktoast
Fiji
Singapore (read all 2 entries…)
Why I want to go to this place — 2 years ago
I really want to go to Singapore, but not until it is a democracy and the people have more freedom of political expression.
Milktoast
Fiji
I really want to go to Singapore, but not until it is a democracy and the people have more freedom of political expression.
~**~mmm ~**~
Holland Village
Sorry…Actually, your entry made me laugh ;)
Who goes to vacation and worry about the political situation? Pretty strange to see you worrying about Singapore where it has the most stable political system in Asia. You should worry about whether your family or children would be safe when you vacationing..over here you can even walk alone by yourself, even as a single lady :)
There are so many 3rd world countries in the world where they have so much social chaos and political problems in their countries, so why you are so concern over a developed country’s political system like Singapore? It just like if we were to travel to a developed country like U.S., isn’t it a joke if I were to worry what George bush’s doing for his country?
If millions of tourists here are not concerned on the politics, and esp the locals, so why are you? Strange..
Then few hours later, you came up with another entry of Singapore again that you want to come here once you finish your study…What’s up with that? ..And why no info of the other countries that you listed but only Singapore? Hmmm..
Milktoast
Fiji
I don’t feel that you can compare the USA and Singapore. Sure, I agree Bush is a wack job but I can say that here without any issues coming up.
I think you can sum up my feelings on the matter with this quote from Abbie Hoffman
“You measure a democracy by the freedom it gives its dissidents, not the freedom it gives its assimilated conformists.”
~**~mmm ~**~
Holland Village
Though it took you 1 week to think through and reply :)
OH I wasn’t comparing, I was merely giving an example..did you misread it?
Have you live in both countries before? And have you been to several countries before? I have. And if you really want me to compare, I personally still prefer to live in Singapore..and so do those who been here and choose to live here, that’s why almost HALF of the population here are made up of foreigners.
I enjoy every possible kind of freedom here, but most of it, I enjoy the freedom of being SAFE here, the kids can walk around here and come back late with no hassle or worries about getting mobbed or killed by people. Can you do that in the 3rd world countries or even developed nations such as U.S.?
Another impt freedom I enjoy is the economy freedom, with that free trade privileage, you can find almost everything within your doorstep.(Hong Kong and Singapore are 2 top countries with the highest economy freedom in more than a decade ago, in case you are not aware again)
With that comes in the finanical freedom, we enjoy the privilege of having one of the world’s highest saving rate. We don’t live pay check to pay check, unlike those cases in the U.S. E.g. I was in the shock to learn that almost every one can own a credit card over there, regardless whether you have any money in the bank or not..It’s quite a diff scenario here whereby you do need to earn like $30k per year in order to obtain a basic card & $60k for a gold card…So with all that freedom, privileages, social STABILITY, and quality of life to enjoy in our environment, what more can a person ask for?
SO now you tell me, which is more impt in life, financial freedom or politcal freedom? With money, you can do what you want including travelling the world. With political freedom, can you get to see the world?
Perhaps you haven’t stepped outside your world of America, I noticed that in the U.S. ppl talk about politics all e time, regardless whether you are politicans or not..It’s quite a culture shock to me and quite a diff scene from e rest of the world :) Nobody really cares about politics here, unless you intend to be a politican :).. If the politicians are doing the good job for the country, we would still vote for them regardless, it’s voting system in case you haven’t heard of it again. So learn to live with the idea we have a diff system here and it works in our country. STOP critizing about other countries’ govt system that’s diff from yours.
Also, if you want to view voting for the same govt as being comformed, then I can’t help you. We just happened to be open minded and smart enough to think for the whole nation first before individual greed.
The world is about constant change, and Singapore(though a very small country) I noticed always seem to be on the lead for being progressive and competitive, I noticed quite a few ppl in this world, including yourself, haven’t caught up FAST ENOUGH with what’s the latest notion of living well and safe. We are living in year 2006 now, not 1980 :)
I suggest till you have really stepped in here, then you pass a judgement on us, otherwise you are just making yourself look radiculous with those naive comments. And to be honest with you, your goal about singapore on 43 things is really bizarre, making ppl feel how ignorant you are..What is your true intention or goal to achieve on this site?
BTW, why no write up on other countries except us? Why not other asia countries like china or korea? What’s your fascination about us? Why are you even thinking of coming here if you are already thinking of us so badly..Oh, we don’t have rooms for negative or ignorant people here in Singapore btw. Why do I feel like I have seen you somewhere before..hmm..
P.S. That “Abbie Hoffman” is an American.. Perhaps you should consider “reading” something OUTSIDE “American” :)
Milktoast
Fiji
To be fair it was only 3 days.
I don’t think you know “Abbie Hoffman” and if you do you know my point. He was allowed in the USA, in much of the world he would just be killed/jailed/thrown to the wolves.
I’m not really sure how to reply to you as you basically make my case for me.
~**~mmm ~**~
Holland Village
Well I don’t have to or need to know anything about any act of dissidents because I am simply not interested to learn or pick up any chaotic or negative lifestyle. Just so you know, we happen to have high respect for laws here as compared to the place or places you are in now or been before :)
Oh sorry to disappoint you, but I didn’t make your case because I was merely trying to be sacrastic :)
Obviously we do not share the same views about Singapore. But I live in the country and you don’t. I find it PRESUMPTIOUS on your part TO INSIST on swallowing the obviously biased literature that you have been fed about us.
But there is nothing wrong with agreeing to disagree. Just do not PICK US as a target. There are more than 150 countries out there, I dare say that only a handful would claim to enjoy peace and prosperity the way we do in Singapore. So go fly your kite or milk your toast in places that deserve your attention more than we do.
Just remember what “you think” is “right”, might not be right for us or others. Leave us alone and let us live our VERY peaceful life here as we certainly do not need you to visit us to stir up to any chaotic lifestyle which we had experienced in the good old days in the 1950s and 60s (when we first gained our independence)..SO if your mindset is stuck in the 50s and 60s, I really can’t help you. Till you have travelled much and grow a bit wiser and more positive, then perhaps come visit Singapore.
Oh another thing, this is a travel site, NOT POLITICAL site. Sorry to learn that you can’t even tell the difference, hence, I can’t expect you know the real good stuff in Singapore.
Oh ya, if you do make your way here some day, just remember that this is Singapore, not China or Soviet Union, as we are no where near them geographically, don’t mix up with the wrong country again :)
So if you excuse me now for I need to go enjoy my peaceful good life here in Singapore. Good luck in your “rebel” cause or search for the next country to target on!
Beaulotus is very busy
Modena
I have spent at least 7 years of my life trying to define “democracy” and sigh, without much success alas. So I have since become very careful how I throw the term around.
I would therefore interpret your neat little quote from a long-ago drug-trafficking Yippie as trying to say this : “That decent governments treat their dissidents decently; that we should not applaud governments that only treat decently those who support them.”
I like the way it sounded. It certainly would be preferable if we decide to go against the Establishment (for whatever reason) to know that we could get away with it. Even if other people who disagree with us should be inconvenienced while we’re at it. Yeah boy, some days you win, some days I do :-). And may the loudest (always)win.
And you are certainly right that we cannot compare the USA and Singapore. One is very big and the other very small. The former is 200 years older and has as many times more issues at hand. It’s also a weird country (to small-minded me) where criminals could write a book about themselves and earn lots of money and fans. Certainly a land whose streets are paved with gold.
Besides, you can have a million dissidents in the USA and ferret half of them secretly out of the country to be dealt with somewhere else and nobody is any the wiser. In Singapore, you have one dissident and everyone knows him :-).
But I still do not see the reason for this dig. What did Singapore do to our (political) dissidents (what a dissident is is another discussion I will not enter into now)? Did we poison them, imprison them, kill them, put them under house arrest? Not as far as I know. Whereas Hoffman, by the way, was jailed and was a fugitive before that.
A dissident in Singapore will probably be sued to bankruptcy for defamation and whether the judiciary is questionable will be presumptious for outsiders to imply. And what is money when you are still alive to fight your battle another day? Besides people usually have a soft spot for underdogs, Singaporeans are no different :-).
But he’ll more likely just hang around to bide his time, for the country is young, always evolving, perpetually undergoing change.
Most of them usually attempt to push through their agenda through the legitimate political process, for if you are alone in your battle, you would do better to stand on a chair in a corner of Hyde Park and bother only those who happen to be there.
And there is a political process in Singapore, contrary to what our detractors insist on denying. Sometimes I get the impression that people do not want Singapore to progress politically, that what they really want is for the people to all go against the Government (who for all its faults has been doing a good job) and experience chaos like almost everywhere else.
And why the hell should outsiders keep telling us what we should do and how we should live? Especially when we are doing pretty well ourselves, no thank you.
And what amazed me too is the fact that some should see the stones in other people but miss out the rock in their own eyes. In the 1st presidential elections, Bush manipulated the voting lists keeping Black and other coloured people from voting. These people are not even dissidents. They were just potential Democrat voters.
And what is a conformist? Someone who looks at a clean handkerchief and does not insist that it is bloodstained? Even dissidents in Singapore enjoy the same high standards of living as the “conformists”. At the very least Singapore treats her “conformists” well, for in many other countries people who “conform” need not necessarily have enough to eat, clean and safe streets or an equal chance to education, healthcare, employment and lodgings.
But it is good to have ideals and ideas and expose them, and I do applaud you for that. As long as I get the right to disagree :-).
PS : In Chinese culture, we have a little story of how a rock didn’t have a big hole in it because someone used a big hard thing to hit on it. It got its hole through days, weeks and months of little droplets of water falling onto it. The rock as such didn’t have big ugly cracks, but a smooth, unbroken surface with a nice hole in it :-).